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Court Estate Gold x Amish Snap

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  • Court Estate Gold x Amish Snap

    I made the cross in 2013. Breeding aim is a yellow snap pea that is larger than Opal Creek but good tasting and high yielding.

  • #2
    That first F1 pod (shown in the photo above) had six seeds inside and I am trying to fit a second generation into one year, the F2 generation. The seeds were not entirely mature and not dried. However, all six germinated, two much later than the other 4. Currently the plants are:

    F2/1 a white flowered green smallish mangetout

    F2/2 a white flowered yellow mangetout, size halfway between CEG and Golden Sweet. This is the tallest plant at near 5 ft tall

    F2/3 a white flowered green mangetout, same pod size as F2/2. The foliage on this plant has deteriorated badly, but one pod is nearly mature (with I think 5 seeds).

    F2/4 has a purple anthocyanin ring in the axils, some yellow in the foliage/tendrils etc, purple flowers. I believe we have a snap pod. see photo. However this pod has hardly grown at all, neither in length nor width in the last week. A second pod has developed, again so short, narrow and thin-walled that I think it is a snap, but can't even be absolutely sure of that. What is good is that this plant has numerous side-shoots, which (should the pods grow into anything desirable in the end), would be a very useful feature for a new variety.

    The slow development of this pod was mirrored by the slow development of F2/2 compared to F2/3, Jayb commented that there is less chlorophylll in yellower plants (and both F2/2 and F2/4 have yellow stems, tendrils and partially calyces) which might account for less photosynthesis and rapid development. Certainly the cool weather might have something to do with it. Thinking about it, in June when most peas of the first generation this year developed, there are of course more daylight hours than in mid-September, another factor that influences development. Plus there is a little mildew on this plant, which doesn't help either..

    F2/5 has not flowered yet, although it is a sizeable plant.

    F2/6 was the last one to germinate and has perished.
    Last edited by Galina; 21-09-2014, 09:04. Reason: better clarity of facts and flow of language

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    • #3
      With this cross I was a bit wary about single flowers. CEG is not often double flowered, but Amish Snap is. F2/4 has now developed a double flower. Good branching and double flowers! Just wish the pods were bigger. But at least it proves that the gene for double flowers is there somewhere in this cross (if a bit shy).. F2/1, F2/2 and F2/3 as well as the F1 plant was/are single flowered.
      Last edited by Galina; 19-09-2014, 07:41.

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      • #4
        Good to hear you have a double and it's yellow podded
        F2/5 perhaps not what you are looking for if it is going to be a late cropper?

        I've again been going through the seeds you sent (lovely thanks) and I'm really looking forward to growing these next spring.
        Last edited by jayb; 19-09-2014, 07:48. Reason: Spelling

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        • #5
          Thank you Jayb. Well F2/5 germinated much later.This is why I can't say that it is a late plant. And as of yesterday it has a flowerbud. Antho and what looks like it is going to be a purple flower and most likely green podded (if we ever get that far).

          F2/5 is over 4ft tall. The tallest plant at 6ft is F2/2 with its 4 yellow mangetouts, the others are around 5ft. F2/4 has the most 'plant material' by far, because of all the side shoots (which are flowering). The pods on F2/4 are not very big, smaller than Opal Creek, but there are now 4 pods. This one still remains the best plant/

          It is going to be super to compare what we are getting in our respective F2 grow-outs . .
          Last edited by Galina; 19-09-2014, 07:42.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Galina View Post

            It is going to be super to compare what we are getting in our respective F2 grow-outs . .
            Super cool!

            Good point about the F2/5 being later to germinate.

            How big a pod are Amish Snap?

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            • #7
              Not as large as Sugar Lord and even a tiny bit smaller than Sugar Snap. I am mulling over crossing CEG with Sugar Lord (which I didn't of course know about last year when I made the cross). The good thing about Amish Snap is that they are both early and late harvesting. And CEG can also be late if kept well watered. But I was impressed with Sugar Lord's endurance as well, although Amish Snap is earlier.
              Last edited by Galina; 20-09-2014, 17:14.

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              • #8
                Noticed the first signs of mildew spots on the pods of F2/2 and F2/3 and had to harvest the pods. Should be ok. The F3 seeds look big enough to be viable.

                ​Here is a photo of the snap pod (or is it?) F2/4

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                • #9
                  They look like they will be fine, well done. Cuts down the waiting time to get 2 crops in a season
                  Ooh, that looks interesting, definitely potentially a snap

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                  • #10
                    Thank you Jayb! Glad you agree that it might be a snap, although not a big one and with the same thin walled characteristic that Opal Creek has. I am pleased with the more golden colour. That is CEG coming through. The picture shows the second pod, the first one is shorter but now has a bulge (which I think means that one seed is developing inside). Good, because mildew is getting to be an issue now. Ideally I want a few seeds but the seeds from the pod in the picture need at least another 2 weeks.
                    Last edited by Galina; 21-09-2014, 14:05.

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                    • #11
                      Rogue's gallery of all 4 F2 types (the 5th type is just developing a green pod, but weeks behind) - heavily mildewed. There are 5 pods of F2/4.

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                      • #12
                        Snaps look nice. Glad you got some for seed.

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                        • #13
                          Well the first snaps have matured this year. F3 From the F2/4 plant. And they are definitely snaps. Time for a name I guess - Court Estate Snap.

                          Hope we will get to taste some some soon. They are not as large as I had hoped, so the search is still on for a much bigger snap, but I love them and wanted to show you the first few, rather the badly mildewed F2s from October last year.

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                          • #14
                            and double flowered too. I was going to suggest a back cross to one of the parents to reinstate the flX2 trait, but no need.

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                            • Galina
                              Galina commented
                              Editing a comment
                              I am pleased with this too because the F1 was single and one of the parents, Court Estate Gold, does not often have double pods. One of this year's test grows was to only take seed from double podding CEGs. No double pod so far on these plants.

                          • #15
                            Oh they are lovely too, I'm loving all your peas!
                            Hope you find your bigger snap.

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